On December 5th,
1990 , the San Diego Padres and Toronto Blue Jays decided to make a
trade. This trade involved two players
who would combine for almost 900 home runs for their careers. They also allowed these two players to also
take along their favorite middle infielder with them to their new teams. So that was cool.
Joe Carter picked his next door neighbor in the field
Roberto Alomar, so they went down to their bank, cashed their last paycheck
from that year and converted them to Loonies for their trip north. Fred McGriff thought it would be fun to see
Tony Fernandez hit triples in San Diego . Those four players finished their career with
almost 9700 hits. Lot
of talent there.
So San
Diego , how’d that turn out for you? While they couldn’t get to the World Series,
or even the playoffs (even paired with Tony Gwynn and Benito Santiago), they
did manage to turn Fred McGriff and Tony Fernandez into Vince Moore, Donnie
Elliott, Melvin Nieves, D.J. Dozier, Wally Whitehurst, and Raul Casanova. If you look at all of those players’ careers,
I’m guessing they wouldn’t come close to 9700 hits if you started counting in
tee ball.
Now, onto the players themselves. I’ve always thought more of Fred
McGriff. Not sure why, just thought he
was the better player. He was a little
younger though, so perhaps McGriff’s later success with the Braves erased
Carter’s success with the Blue Jays in my mind.
Let’s start with Carter.
Oh, wait, yeah, since this is my first post, I’m not really
going to put much about players’ early lives.
Wikipedia has a lot of neat, mostly accurate stuff. Surf responsibly.
Joe Carter was drafted in the first round – second overall!
– in 1981 by the Chicago Cubs out of Wichita
State University July 30, 1983 to participate in a Cubs double
header in Philadelphia . The spry Carter was called upon to pinch run
for Ron “The Penguin” Cey after he doubled in Bill Bucknor to give the Cubs a
4-3 lead. Carter would be stranded there
and the Cubs, not wanting to do anything easy, allowed a Pete Rose single, a
Joe Morgan walk (and stolen base on a double steal!), and a Lonnie Smith walk
before Von Hayes struck out with the bases loaded to end the game.
Carter started the second game of the double header, going
0-4 with three strikeouts in a Cubs 4-3 loss.
All three Cubs RBIs were from a single from Ryne Sandberg and TWO solo
home runs by the Penguin. Carter would
have to endure one more 0-4 outing the next day before finally getting his
first hit and RBI in the final game of the series.
Hopefully
I haven’t bored you too much! Sometimes
I have a tendency to ramble. But I think
most of this is good stuff, and maybe even learned something. I didn’t know that Carter stole 40 bases one
year in the minors, and assuming you weren’t sitting there with your 1992 Leaf
Joe Carter card, you probably didn’t either.
Carter struggled in his first partial season in the bigs,
sporting a .176 batting average with no walks and 21 strikeouts in 51 at
bats. The Cubs sent him back to the
minors to start the next season. In mid
June of 1984, he was traded to the land of whatever is the opposite of milk and
honey, Cleveland , with a handful of
players in the Wally Whitehurst mold for Rick Sutcliffe and a handful of
players in the Wally Whitehurst mold. The
Cubs probably looked like geniuses at the time with Sutcliffe going 16-1 in 20
games the rest of the season and winning the NL Cy Young Award. He went on to win 82 games in 8 years in Chicago .
So what did
His remaining years in Cleveland
saw him transform more into the Pedro Cerrano style hitter, though I’m not
certain of his thoughts on whether Jesus Christ could hit a curveball. In 1989 he hit a career high 35 home runs,
and a lowest-to-that-point-of-his-career .243 average. His stolen bases also fell from 27 the
previous season to 13 that season. Cleveland ,
sensing Carter was about to get expensive, decided to ship him off to a San
Diego for a one year vacation.
Oh, that year in San Diego . I’m sure that the weather was nice. It was so nice, he decided to play every game
that year, one of four seasons he did so.
He had a pretty Joe Carter year with 24 home runs, 115 RBIs and 22
stolen bases. For the first time in his
career, he had more than 40 walks with 48.
Then there is the .232 batting average.
1990 was just about the end of the pre-steroid era, but I’m guessing
that 1990 Joe Carter doesn’t equal, say, 2005 Adam Dunn. Although I’d LOVE to see Adam Dunn with 28
steal attempts. I’d probably be up in
the stands all like “RUN DUNN RUN!!!”
Anyway, Carter’s BAbip that year was .234. Actually, looking at his career, his BAbip was
pretty closely aligned with his actual batting average. Joe Carter didn’t believe in luck. He made his own luck. 1990 is also an outlier based upon his WAR,
which was -1.8 that year. Just looking
at his career numbers, it sticks out like a sore thumb. And it sticks out even more when you see the
4.7 WAR he put up in his first year in Toronto
in 1991. Stack that against his WAR from
the previous year, and that’s a 6.5 WAR swing.
Over the next six years, Carter would bat in the mid .250s
to mid .270s. He hit 182 home runs,
drove in 634 runs and stole 70 bases. His
first three years in Toronto were
marked with the playoffs, where he hit 6 home runs and drove in 20 runs. These were the only three years of his career
he made the playoffs. Oh yeah, and the
before mentioned two World Series wins.
He also made the all star team in 5 of those 6 years. He received MVP votes in his first four years
in Toronto , peaking at third in
1992. He also added 2 Silver Slugger
awards.
Some players, in the last year of their contracts, have
career years. Joe Carter seemed to have
the opposite of that. His earlier last
years in Cleveland and San
Diego showed it was clearly time to move on. While his numbers weren’t horrible, his
batting average fell to .234 and his home run count fell to 21, his lowest
total since he hit only 15 in 1985. At
age 37, his wheels were mostly gone, stealing only 8 bases that year.
Wanting to give it one more go, he signed with the division
rival Baltimore Orioles. In a partial
season, things didn’t get much better. A
mid season trade to the Giants seemed to be somewhat of a shot of fresh
air. In the final 41 games of his
career, he batted .295 and tacked on an extra 7 home runs. His final game was on Sept. 28, 1998 as he went 0-4 with a walk and a
strikeout. He finished his career with
396 home runs, good for 55th all time.
In 2004 he appeared on the Hall of Fame ballot. Unfortunately, his stay was more reminiscent of
his San Diego days than his Toronto
career. He only garnered 3.8% of the
vote. This ballot elected fellow former Toronto
teammate Paul Molitor, along with Dennis Eckersley (both on the first
ballot). It also featured future Hall of
Famers Ryne Sandberg, Bruce Sutter, Jim Rice, Andre Dawson, Goose Gossage, and
Bert Blyleven. Failing to meet the 5%
necessary to continue, that was the end of his Hall of Fame chance.
Honestly, I didn’t mean
to write so much. But in going back in
looking at Joe Carter, he seems to be a lot like I remember him. Pretty solid, possibly underrated, but
probably not a Hall of Famer. And we
didn’t even talk about his defense. Had
he simply been an average defender, his WAR would have been around 35 for his
career. Instead, his overall career WAR
was 19.4. His dWAR in his 7 years in
Toronto was -7.6. Think back though; it
wouldn’t really have been in Toronto’s best interest to move him to first base
with John Olerud manning the position.
Olerud’s CAREER fielding percentage was .995. His later years in Toronto featured Molitor
at DH. Then there was some guy by the
name of Dave Winfield that had that gig for a year. And in his first year, there was no way he
was going to supplant Rance Mulliniks.
Mulliniks was The Franchise. So
going by Little League rules, they looked at his defense and said, put him in
right field. No one ever hits it over
there anyway.
Intermission sponsored by Mark
Reynolds
Seeing how I’ve rambled on for quite awhile, we need an
intermission. This intermission is
sponsored by Mark Reynolds. Let’s relive
Joe Carter’s epic walk off World Series home run…Mark Reynolds’ style!
Mark Reynolds would like to remind you that, according to
the packaging, sunflower seeds are an excellent source of protein and
sodium. They probably have some sort of
heart healthy oil in them too.
Before we declare McGriff the clear winner, let’s get a
chance to pick him apart.
Fred McGriff was also
drafted in 1981, but he had to wait until the 9th round to be selected
by the New York Yankees. After a year
and a half in the Yankees minor league system, he put up numbers you’d expect from
a 9th round pick. He had a
.243 average and 9 home runs to go along with 50 RBIs and only 6 stolen
bases. Personally, I’m unfamiliar with
the state of the Toronto Blue Jays’ minor league system from the early 1980’s,
but when the Yankees approached them about a trade after the 1982 season
involving McGriff, Dave Collins and Mike Morgan for Todd Dowd and Dale Murray,
they accepted. When Murray
arrived at Spring Training the following year, they said, oh, MURRAY . I thought you got Dale MURPHY.
Over the next 4 years, he kept putting up those same 9th
round type numbers. He did manage one
short stint batting .311 over 33 games in A ball, but after that, his highest
minor league average was .249. He did
start to display some power, but seemed to trade that for strike outs while his
walk rate declined. Still, he was called
up to Toronto for a brief stint in
1986, debuting on May 17. His first
appearance was as a defensive replacement for Willie Upshaw against…Joe Carter’s
Cleveland Indians. The next day, McGriff
got the start at DH and singled in his first at bat. After coming around to score, I guess the Jays
thought that he’d had enough for the day.
He was pinch hit for in the third inning. Two days later, he played in his third and
final game of the 1986 campaign and went 0-4 with 2 strikeouts.
In 1987, the Jays, for the most part, turned over the DH
keys to McGriff. Despite playing in only
107 games, he teamed up with George Bell, Lloyd Moseby and Jesse Barfield to all
hit 20 or more home runs. If Ernie Whitt
could have gotten with the frickin’ program and hit one more homer, they would
have had 5 players with 20 or more. When
McGriff wasn’t at DH, they also had another young player who seemed suited for
the DH position that went by the name of Cecil Fielder. Fielder put up another 14 home runs that
year, so that was a pretty productive DH spot that year. Probably less impressive when you look at the
fact that the baseballs were on Winstrol that year, but that’s the hand we were
dealt. McGriff finished the year with 20
home runs, 43 RBIs and a .243 average.
1988 seems to be the year that McGriff started to figure it
all out. It was the first year in a
string of eight years he had votes in the MVP race, including four top
tens. Playing full time now at first
base, he hit 34 home runs, drove in 82 RBIs, scored 100 runs, and hit
.282. While his strikeouts hit a career
high 149, he did walk 79 times to somewhat offset that. He also let the league in fielding percentage
at .997 at first base, also a career high.
In his final two years in Toronto ,
McGriff, presumable powered by poutine, crushed 71 home runs and drove in 180
runs. In 1989, he only batted .269, but
drew 119 walks vs. 132 strikeouts. The
next year, he hit an even .300 and narrowed the gap between his walks and
strikeouts to 94 vs. 108. But the Blue
Jays had another first baseman coming up, the previously mentioned Olerud. In 1991 and 1992, Olerud would go on to make
a little under $700,000. McGriff, traded
to the Padres, made $6.8 million in those same years. Plus Olerud WORE A HELMET IN THE FIELD. How badass was that?
Over his two and a half years in a Padres uniform, Fred
McGriff was very complimentary of the way that Tony Gwynn conducted his
business, and probably enjoyed the weather as much as Carter did. While he never really threatened the .300
mark, he did his 30+ home run, 100+ RBI thing, and hovered around the .990 mark
in the field. But, based upon the above
salary considerations, the Padres probably knew this couldn’t continue. In one of those I-hope-this-works moves, the
Padres traded him to the Braves for some of those guys I mentioned towards the
top of the blog. I can’t even remember
their names now, and I just typed them earlier today. So you probably have forgotten them too. And that’s ok. So has history.
The Braves probably
thought Fred McGriff would be a better option at first base than Sid
Bream. I’m sorry. Give me a minute. I thought I’d be able to type that without
getting all emotional.
OK, I’m better now.
Going back to my fantasy baseball draft from 1993, I do see that I did
have McGriff listed above Sid Bream. In
the second half of the season, McGriff settled right into the Braves lineup,
batting .310 the rest of the way and hitting 19 home runs in only 68 games.
1994 saw McGriff finish his streak of seven seasons with 30+
home runs as he put up 34 that year to go along with 94 RBIs. Had we not been robbed of the final 50 games
of that season due to the strike, McGriff would almost certainly have hit at
least 7 more home runs (more on that later).
He also hit a career high .318 that year.
His final three years in Atlanta
all featured appearances in the NLCS, with a two World Series appearances and a
World Series victory in 1995. While he
didn’t hit .300 again, he was an above average hitter with a combined 87 home
runs and 297 RBIs. This closed out his
career in Atlanta .
1998 featured the debut of two new expansion teams – the Diamondbacks
and the Devil Rays. McGriff’s contract
was purchased by the Devil Rays, giving McGriff the opportunity to play in his
home town. McGriff kept doing Fred
McGriff things, averaging between .277 and .310 over the next 3 ½ years. He also hit 97 home runs and 352 runs playing
mostly first base, but also getting a few days at DH.
The middle of the 2001 season saw McGriff traded back to the
NL, with him going to the Cubs. While
some may have wondered, at ages 37 and 38, how much longer McGriff could play
the field, he rewarded the Cubs with a fielding percentage of .992 over a
season and a half at first base. In 195 games, he also hit 44 home runs and
drove in 144 RBIs for the Cubbies while batting a respectable .276.
2003 saw him sign with the Los Angeles Dodgers. You learn something every day! By this time, he was just collecting a
paycheck. His .249 average was his
lowest since the Reagan administration, and he only tacked on another 13 home
runs in 86 games.
In 2004, he resigned with the Rays towards the end of Spring
Training. I’m assuming this was just so
he could sit in the dugout at home games and drink free Gatorade. He batted .181 in his final handful of
appearances for his hometown team. His
final game was on July 15 of that year as he went 0-3 with a strikeout.
McGriff was named to the All Star team five times, winning
the MVP in the 1994 game. He also won a
Silver Slugger award three times. His
493 home runs rank in a tie for 26th all time with Lou Gehrig. Unfortunately, baseball writers are so
focused on round numbers that 493 doesn’t look nearly as sexy as 500. His name first appeared on the Hall of Fame
ballot in 2010, garnering 21.5% of the vote.
Since then, he has mainly hovered around the same rate, although with
this year’s loaded ballot, he fell to 11.7%.
He’s still above the necessary 5% to remain on the ballot, but with the
archaic rules of only allowing ten votes per ballot, it’s going to be awfully
hard for him to remain, let alone be elected.
And, OK, I’ve avoided it
for the entire blog, but when it’s all said and done, Joe Carter didn’t even
have a nickname. Fred McGriff is the CRIME DOG. I mean, you could tell me that Joe Carter
finished his career with 396 home runs and Fred McGriff’s nickname is the CRIME DOG, then ask me who was the
better player, if I didn’t have any prior knowledge to either player, I don’t
think I’d be able to accurately guess.
Fred McGriff could be one of the tens of thousands of players who hit
fewer than 396 home runs, but I mean, come on, he’s the CRIME DOG.
Who was the better player?
My opinion was it was McGriff.
But I guess that it depends one what you look at. Carter might look down at his second WS ring
and laugh at me. McGriff might point out
that he’s tied with Lou Gehrig on the home run list. And Lou Gehrig is one of the most beloved
baseball players of all time. Need a
stolen base? Sorry Fred. How about a walk? Probably not going with Joe. Wichita
State Tampa ? Tonight, we dine with the CRIME DOG.
I hope you enjoyed this, or at least didn’t fall
asleep. There will be more to come in
the future!
No comments:
Post a Comment